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Reply with quote  #1 
While reading the background info on jack i came across a line that i found very interesting. It says that in 1946 jack returned to the Texarcana area and carried out the Texarcana Phantom Murders. I searched this site several times but could not find any more info on this subject. The statement reads as if it is a known fact that jack carried out these crimes. The story of how the cops killed jacks girlfreind does show that he would have a motive to commit these crimes, but thats not good enough. I assume there is some other evidence to back this claim up. I am interested in knowing what this evidence is.


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Reply with quote  #2 
Quote:
but thats not good enough


"Billy",

With all due respect, if what you're looking for is existing physical evidence, then you've become interested in the wrong case. You will not find physical evidence on Tom Voigt's site; you will not find it in the books of Robert Graysmith; you will not find it in the fascinating study psychological study This Is The Zodiac Speaking or the YouTube videos by its co-author; you will not find it here. In fact, you will not find it anywhere BECAUSE THERE IS NONE.

It almost seems, "Billy", as if you're trying to discredit Dennis because he does not have existing physical evidence to back up his claim. Of course you are entitled to your opinion, but you're beating a dead horse here. This board (and all other Zodiac discussions) is meant to discuss what WE HAVE. Namely, circumstantial evidence.


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Reply with quote  #3 
With all due respect to you, dennis does not even present any circumstantial evidence to back up this claim. Is the story of jacks girlfreind being killed by the cops and jack being pissed and wanting revenge the only thing dennis has to make this claim? If so, thats not even near circumstantial. To make a statement like this i would expect someone to have at least more than that. When it comes to accusations like these, i dont just take someones word for it. I, like any detective, need proof.
JCloser

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Reply with quote  #4 
With all due respect to you "T.V. the Kid", how do we even know that there ever was as SAM? That whole thing sounds like a pathetic attempt to grant yourself some importance. Of all the people on your site, you are the one with the weakest ideas. Every time people come up with something original you slam them because you feel very small that your sole contribution is your site, and not your intellect. The whole SAM fabrication is a way to deal yourself in as a player! "Oh sorry, I can't provide 1 bid of evidence that SAM ever existed due to legal constraints" pathetic!
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DiamondD

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Reply with quote  #5 
Every time the movie The Town That Dreaded Sundown is on I watch it and think Jack you bugger you, we now know who you are...
clamper1004

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Reply with quote  #6 
I found a website with these murders on it. The drawing they had of the Killer was wearing a hood kind of Like LB and it gave me chills. This description came from the first victims who happen to survive. I'll try and find this site again.
JCloser

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Reply with quote  #7 
That would be great
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clamper1004

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Reply with quote  #8 
I found the site go to http://www.crimelibrary.com and enter texarkana in the search and go to the article by Joseph Geringer, the drawing is creepy. It gives ya shivers to think that this might be Jack in training.
Winnie

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Reply with quote  #9 
There is an account of Jack borrowing his Uncle's car during this time, and then returning it, in alright condition, however...
for some reason, Jack had changed all four tires...

Dennis knows the story...
This may help, too..
Tex-arcana is on the radian angle if you extrapolate from the base meridian where Mt. Diablo is set... it spans all the way across. The geographical aspect is very relevant as Jack had joined the Navy to escape the cops and his girlfriend's dad, who happened to be his boss at the time... So the Naval mathematical and nautical training was fresh and Jack's mind was sharp as a tack, even though he only had an 8th grade education, he certainly applied himself in all realms of curriculum through his Armed Forces and other experiences, such as General Electric.

Note, there are other base meridian circles in California, as well...San Diego, for instance... and they all connect in part along the radians, as does Tex-arcana.






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Reply with quote  #10 
Well look who's back. Hi, Tina.
Winnie

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Reply with quote  #11 
Hey JoAnne, it's good to be back...

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goldeneagle

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Reply with quote  #12 
I think this is an aspect of the case against jack that goes overlooked. There are definitely connections between these two killers, but i dont believe they were the same person. If anything i think zodiac may have gotten some ideas from the tex phantom. The hood is one thing that stands out. I know tv was blasted for bringing this up but it is a good question: besides this story about jacks girl being killed, what else points to jack? Though i dont agree with the jack is zodiac theory, i think dennis has done a great job of putting together his case and presenting it to us. However, i have to say that without something more i have a hard time believing this story.
LtColumbo

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Reply with quote  #13 
Forgive me if I repeat some things I've said on other posts. It's hard to have a discussion on 3 or 4 threads.

There are superficial similarities between serial killers- they are an imitative bunch:

1) Jack the Ripper wrote to the police and coined his own nickname just like Z. Many thought the Black Dahlia could be the work of the Cleveland torso killer. Son of Sam targeted couples in cars, just like the Phantom and Z. The FBI is constantly attributing unsolved cases to known killers on that basis and then being forced to retract the connection.

2) Victims are usually chosen on the basis of vulnerability and availability. Couples in lovers' lanes, prostitutes and hitch-hikers put themselves in dangerous situations and so are popular choices. Unfortunately, women and children are always vulnerable and easy to abduct. Cab drivers and convenience store clerks are the most common murder victims by profession for the same reason. You'll note you don't find any serial killer focusing on bodybuilders, martial arts experts or NRA members.

3) Outside of Agatha Christie novels there are only so many ways to kill people. Guns, knives, strangling and bludgeoning are almost always the method of choice because they are quick and effective.

The thing that bothers me is DK's assertion that Jack hopped a freight train to escape from apprehension in the Texarkana spree. That doesn't happen in the police and Texas Ranger files, it happens only in the memorable last seen in the film 'The Town That Dreaded Sundown'. In real life the authorities used bloodhounds to trail the killer after the last attack until the scent abruptly disappeared. They conclude that the Phantom simply got into his car and drove away. The whole train hopping scene exists only in low budget film maker Charles B. Peirce's imagination. If Jack said he escaped by train after the last Texarkana murder it suggests that he saw the movie more than it suggests that he was the Texarkana Phantom.

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goldeneagle

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Reply with quote  #14 
I dont think Jack was the Phantom. The two have some things in common but I think that's where it ends. I need a little more evidence or proof then what is available.
Karma

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Reply with quote  #15 
The movie I thought of when I read the story is "Legends Of The Fall".

A woman is killed on a road as her husband is stopped by police for selling/transporting moonshine. The husband takes revenge on those who killed her.

This movie was out in 1994, based on novellas from 1979 (not sure if this scene takes place in the novellas or if it was just added in the movie).

"During Prohibition, Tristan becomes involved in smuggling bootleg liquor and finds himself at odds with the O'Banion brothers, who are also bootleggers. Tristan's wife is accidentally killed by a corrupt police officer working for the O'Banions and in a fit of agonized grief, Tristan beats the officer to near death and serves time in jail. After his release from jail, Tristan and his father-in-law kill those responsible for Isabel Two's death. When the remaining O'Banion brother comes for Tristan, he and his men are shot and killed by Colonel Ludlow and Alfred, when Tristan steps in to save his father. Tristan, knowing he will be blamed for the men's disappearance, leaves for the mountain country, after asking Alfred to watch over his children."

-from wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legends_of_the_Fall

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